Where should one draw the line between self-motivation and self-manipulation?

I've read books such as "The Path of Least Resistance" and "The Fifth Discipline" and I do believe that setting up routines (a.k.a environments or systems) for yourself that make it easier for you to succeed and harder for you to fail is good. However, even though I believe that it's good, I don't know if I really "feel" it yet. If that makes any sense.

I think I get into "ready, aim, aim, aim" mode because I can't help but wonder if I'm just trying to manipulate myself into something I may not really want to do in the first place. I mean, if I really wanted something, why would I feel the need to keep motivating/manipulating myself?

Isn't dangling a carrot in front of a donkey just as manipulative as cracking a whip from behind him? Whether it's postive reinforcement or negative, isn't it still rein**FORCE**ment?

Anyone remember Soundgarden's music video for "Black Hole Sun"? I don't know why, but I just seem to get that image in the back of my head whenever I try to think of ways to motivate myself.

I hope I'm not discouraging anyone by bringing this up. I just would like to hear some other perspectives on this. So by all means, please feel free to make swiss cheese of my argument. :)

If you look at it, both self-motivation and self-manipulation can be the same things. Giving motivation and Manipulating are just two ways to look at convincing yourself into doing something.

Mostly, Motivation is where you like what youre doing, but don't have the strength of will to do it. Manipulating is going a step byond, where you have to convince yourself that you have to do what youre doing (before finding the emotional powers to do it).

From reading your post, i think that your goal isn't so clear in your eyes. You think you are manipulating yourself into doing something. stop and try to think why youre doing what youre doing, and take a good long look so if it is the path you chose, let it be the path you are certain on because you dont want to spend the rest of it thinking it was the wrong one.

Anyone remember Soundgarden's music video for "Black Hole Sun"? I don't know why, but I just seem to get that image in the back of my head whenever I try to think of ways to motivate myself.

that was a horrible video clip. took me years to repress it...

-Gil

For those who read NLP books, you should know this.
There are two types of motivation. One is motivation by desperation(or Away-From Motivation) and the other is Motivation by Want/Desire(aka Toward motivation).
In the former case you are motivated to get away from a situation and in the latter you are motivated because you want something. For example, when you set up alarm in the morning, though you may not want to get up, you do get up because your mind warns you and produces mental pictures of you being late and being penalized for it. So to avoid it(or to get away from it) you wake up.
In the latter case, if you are on a vacation to someplace, you may get up even without an alarm. This is because you want to enjoy your vacation and are looking forward to it. So your mind makes up mental images of you enjoying and so you are motivated to wake up.
We use both kinds of motivation in our life though one of them is predominant. So find out which one you are influenced by and use it.
Also our mind does not know negative words. So instructing yourself that you will not sleep past 6 may work. But instead, if you say you will wake up by 6, the probability is more for it to work.
So stay positive and moticate yourself.
One way i moticate myself is like this. In case i need to work on something and i don't feel like it, i imagine that i have completed the work and imagine all that will happen when i complete it, like the good feeling, the sense of accomplishment, monetary gains if any and so on. I don't think about myself doing the work. I imagine and see myself finishing the work. Then i start working on it. So i am motivating myself by the latter method. This works well for me. Identify your method and work on it. Hope that helps.

To your success,
Gana.

Thanks for the info gilzu and gana.

gilzu wrote:
From reading your post, i think that your goal isn't so clear in your eyes. You think you are manipulating yourself into doing something. stop and try to think why youre doing what youre doing, and take a good long look so if it is the path you chose, let it be the path you are certain on because you dont want to spend the rest of it thinking it was the wrong one.
Yeah, you're right. After thinking about this a bit, and also reading some more of this forum, I believe that I just wasn't being specific enough about what the real goal here is. This probably will sound corny to some, but I think one of my biggest worries is to wake up one day, years later, and be back in that rut of just working for money again. Or having my work totally take up all of my time.

So, for anyone who's interested, I think it's helpful to maybe add goals that define the minimum and the maximum amount of time you want to spend working on your project. And also maybe have goals that define what would and wouldn't be considered "selling out" in your own eyes. I don't know. Maybe there's a better way to go about this... But this should at least be better than simply having one single goal stating something like "My program X is launched by Y date and makes Z amount of money."

I can't help but wonder if I'm just trying to manipulate myself into something I may not really want to do in the first place

I'm confused by that statement. What you want to do is a logical decision, not something hidden inside you. The doubts and inclinations to not work towards what you want are just fear rearing it's ugly head. Fear of change, fear of ridicule, maybe even fear of success, but it's not your subconscious mind telling you what you really want or don't want. You should take a good look at exactly what price you'll have to pay (in free time, financial security, etc.) to accomplish your goal and either resolve to paying it, or change your goal!