I was wondering-

How well did your first release go?
Was your first game a succes story or did it bum out?

How did it effect your future plans and ideas?

thx-
:)

First released game, Tokyo War, made about $300 over its run. It only sold for $5 and was the first title, so it was not too bad.

Alex

PegSweeper (http://www.mrio-software.com/info.php?id=ps&r=dex) sold 11 or 12 copies since its "launch" in june. That's a little over $100 in profits.

Financially, you can safely call it a failure. From most of the other possible points of view, we consider it a success - we put in place the team, the infrastructure and the technology that allowed us to make Betty's Beer Bar (http://www.mrio-software.com/info.php?id=bbb&r=dex), which we consider a success so far (it's been out for a month).

Answering your question about how did that "failure" affect us... it proved it could be done. It proved we could do it. It proved that our success would depend exclusively on us. So, it was very positive.

jumping ball (http://www.ehbgamer.com/jb.htm) was my first game, sold more than 40 copies generating about $360 in 2 years, as ggambett said it proved that I can sell something online (What a great feeling selling ur first copy) ... beside generating a customer base, it gave me many ideas about gaming in general and about improving jumping ball itself.
I think it is a "success" as I learnet many things (making a complete game, making online business, gaining experience interacting with customers) beside getting some money :)
One thing to be mentioned is that downloads.com had a great effect on our sales as we got most of our sales from those days that "jumping ball" was in the "new release" pages

I'm very close to releasing my first commercial game (screenshot (http://www.valengames.com/screenshot.jpg)) and I expect to get roughly the same results as those who posted before me. You can't expect your first release to go great because you most likely won't have any experience selling stuff online. Even if you have a great game it'll be very tough. I expect to improve sales over time though, and to do better with my next game as I learn the business side of game development (I'm also not doing any more clones which should help with sales :)).

I think in one of Steve P's articles he says that usually it takes a couple of attempts (around 3 or 4?) before you get to a point where you have a sustainable income. Remember, Dweep wasn't his first game. I don't remember what number it was exactly though.

Originally posted by Fenix Down
I think in one of Steve P's articles he says that usually it takes a couple of attempts (around 3 or 4?) before you get to a point where you have a sustainable income. Remember, Dweep wasn't his first game. I don't remember what number it was exactly though.

In terms of the number of completed games that were sold commercially, Dweep was actually the 12th individual game I programmed.

Hmmm... that makes me feel really old.

Originally posted by Dexterity
In terms of the number of completed games that were sold commercially, Dweep was actually the 12th individual game I programmed.


Well I meant which number Dweep was out of the games you developed and self published. Please tell me Dweep wasn't your 12th shareware game! :eek: :)

Originally posted by Dexterity
Hmmm... that makes me feel really old.


Makes me feel like a total n00b. :)

Space Station Manager was the first title I self published so I count it as my first. The earlier titles were small custom projects for specific sites (<2 weeks of work). In my view SSM has been successful. I have been able to continue working full time refining SSM and preparing next titles, the original goal in the first place.

Hi-
I would like to thank everyone for the replies-
it keeps things into perspective-

but dont let the thread die out just yet:)

I'm not quite sure what counts as first.

There was this thing I whipped up in Flash in three days and sold off my website for $7 for a couple years, through PayPal, never advertising, never keeping records, so I have no idea how many sales it got.

There's the membership site where I've slapped up similarly quickly-written games with adult content, but they aren't sold individually. My takings on that site this year are a bit over three thousand dollars.

Alien Flux (http://www.puppygames.net/SetupAlienFluxDemo.exe) was (is) my first game and it's doing as miserably as everyone else's games did, having managed about 70 sales in 6 months. I think that's about $1,100 gross after SWREG took their bit but it's cost tons more than that to advertise on download.com, host the site, pay for software, etc. etc. so I've actually lost a couple of $1000 on it over all.

Cas :)

Man that Alien Flux story never fails to get me down - 'cause it surely deserves to do better...

My first finished game was Platypus and it made me very little as I sold it outright for way too small an amount, way too soon in development (I was desperate).

My first self-published game, and what I would consider my true debut title, will be finished next year sometime...

Very first game??

That would be Quexar, circa 1982, for the C-64. Sold a copy to a buddy of mine for about $2. ;)

Is 1982 really 21 years ago????? ARG!

First shareware game would be DungeonLord for the Atari ST, back in 1990. Made a few hundred bucks, IIRC.

Originally posted by princec
Alien Flux (http://www.puppygames.net/SetupAlienFluxDemo.exe) was (is) my first game and it's doing as miserably as everyone else's games did, having managed about 70 sales in 6 months. I think that's about $1,100 gross after SWREG took their bit but it's cost tons more than that to advertise on download.com, host the site, pay for software, etc. etc. so I've actually lost a couple of $1000 on it over all.

Cas :)

princec - Considering how well reviewed and polished Alien Flux is (especially compared to other Indie games), I'm surprised it did not get more sales. What was the problem? Was the conversion rate low or was it just hard generating traffic to the site / download?

I've done a few demos (or more like prototypes), but I should be finishing my first "commercial" Indie game in a couple of months. Right now, I'm a QA Lead at a major videogame console company. I feel pretty miserable there since it will be light-years before I get in a creative role. Not to mention, if I do manage to get in a creative position, I'll be doing someone else’s design (which more likely came from focus group creativity in a board room with a bunch of suits in marketing). However, I do like the people I'm working with in my department and most importantly it pays the bills (well mostly).

But I came to realize if I ever want to make games (which is why I started working at my current job) I'll just have to do it myself. So I became a self-proclaimed Indie and like many of you my goal is to be able to create Indie games full time. Realistically I know I won't be able to leave my day job after my first game, but I would like for it to be at least a possibility after my third or fourth game.

Though maybe to my advantage, I do have some experience getting sales over the Internet. A couple of years back, I ran a dating online personals website similar to matchmaker.com, friendfinder, and etc. It's funny how similar the issues are that I'm reading on these forums today that I had to deal with back then. I went through all the growing pains of trying to determine the conversion rate and then improving it. There was a conversion rate for people who hit the main page and actually signed up. and then there was a conversion rate for people who actually signed up and purchased gold memberships.

It was marginally successful initially (It was a great feeling getting those first sales!). But sales started to drop mysteriously and I was running out marketing funds for search engine keywords, so eventually I had to close the site. But overall, I'd say it was a success because it proved to me that I could get sales over the Internet from something I created from scratch. At its peak, I was getting 3-5 sales a day (approx. 100-120 Gold members a month). I learned how important a conversion rate is and constantly improving it. Even little things. Also, once you have a good conversion rate, I also learned it's not about throwing bulk traffic at it. It's about getting quality targeted traffic.

Example -
"Friends" is a high volume keyword. We got about 300- 500 hits a day from the keyword. We had about a 1% conversion rate (hits on homepage to sign-ups). This was due to it being a generic keyword. Not everyone who typed "Friends" in google was looking for a dating site. Among other things, they could be looking for information on the "Friends" TV sitcom. They click the link to my site out of mild curiosity or on accident, and then go back to looking for Jennifer Anniston. Yet I had to pay for them clicking to my website. High volume is not very efficient especially if you're on a tight marketing budget.

"Custom Dating Profiles" is a low volume keyword. We got maybe about 20 - 30 hits a day from this keyword. However, it has an extremely high conversion rate (hits on homepage to sign-ups), around 25 - 40%! This is because our main selling point was detailed profiles, so we were exactly what they were looking for. But since it is a low volume keyword, it wasn't enough to sustain a site coming from a single search engine. So I went to numerous search engines purchasing this low volume keyword. The goal was to make the low volume keyword (with high CR) a mid - high volume keyword. While it never reached the volume of the "Friends" keyword, I was somewhat successful.

Not only is a 25-40% CR off 35 - 50 hits get more members than a 1% CR off 300 - 500 hits, but when you're paying anywhere from 10 - 55 cents per click, you save drastic amounts of money on the low volume / high CR keyword.

So I have some experience running a business online and generating sales. I'd like to believe the dating site was in essence my "first game". :) However, with the dating site I was selling a service. With the Indie games, I'll be selling a tangible (well sort of) product. There are some differences and the market conditions are quite different.

But with learned lessons (some of them hard) from already running a business online, I'm hoping to get at least respectable sales with my first Indie game. We can dream, right? :D

-Chris

PS.

Sorry to ramble on. I'm new here, so I thought I would introduce myself as well as hopefully provide some useful information.

Super-low conversion rate. And now... no idea.
Time to write another game methinks. Who can tell us how their second game did?

Cas :)

princec - Considering how well reviewed and polished Alien Flux is (especially compared to other Indie games), I'm surprised it did not get more sales. What was the problem?
I don't know, but I am guessing it starts with a "c" and ends with "ontrols"...

Ah yes. Cabbageontrols. Curse of the uncoordinated masses, and game developers everywhere.

On a related note, how many people here are damn annoyed that people can't be relied upon to have a joystick or gamepad for their PC these days? I don't really want to make mouse-driven games. But I know that many people find playing anything but the simplest games with keyboard controls to be hopelessly unmanageable.

There should be some kind of charity that goes around giving PC owners proper joysticks; it'd be a mercy mission, like the doctors that go to Africa to perform cataract operations.

I'd like to do a joystick bundle deal - buy Phallus Mk IV, get $5 off Puppy Games Robotron Death Squad - or something.

Cas :)

I for one don't have a gamepad for my PC anymore, seems somehow redundant given that I have three pads (2 xbox, 1 dreamcast) lying around anyway.. too bad there isn't a standard universal connector for pads (though of course that wouldn't be possible given the need for a pad to have enough buttons for EVERY game on the platform it was designed for).

I really only use my joystick (actually I have about six) for flight simulators anymore. Back when I was playing Mechwarrior II, I was using a joystick - and struggling in multiplayer. One night the joystick was acting flakey, so I forced myself to use mouse + keyboard... and never went back. The mouse is a far more precise controller.

In fact, I'm extremely resentful that Mechwarrior IV is effectively unplayable without a joystick. I have TRIED several times to configure the game without using a joystick, and it has become apparent that:

#1 - You cannot disable the joystick if it's plugged in - the only way to turn off joystick control is to yank it out of the port, and

#2 - Keyboard controls are USELESS. And controls are different in Tutorial mode from the actual game.

Ugly design. Mechs aren't supposed to be that uncontrollable. Now give me airplane or a space fighter - there I'll use the joystick.

Originally posted by Henrik
I for one don't have a gamepad for my PC anymore, seems somehow redundant given that I have three pads (2 xbox, 1 dreamcast) lying around anyway.. too bad there isn't a standard universal connector for pads (though of course that wouldn't be possible given the need for a pad to have enough buttons for EVERY game on the platform it was designed for).

There are a lot of console->PC controller adapters--check somewhere like http://www.lik-sang.com/list.php?category=55& for an idea of what's available.

And, on topic, I'll post some info about how our first game is doing later today.

Yeh I've got a Playstation adaptor myself - very handy... the only gripe I have with the unit is that I bought a version that doesn't support the Dual Shock feature but for the ease of use (both analog sticks recognised) and cheap price (£10 for the adaptor - you need a playstation pad of course) you can't fault them!

Our first game, Beesly's Buzzwords, launched a few weeks ago. Currently, it's available at RealOne Arcade (http://games.real.com/game.php?gameid=B57439CA-1E22-11B2-A9B9-00D0B7142009&pageid=index-hotnew) and Big Fish Games (http://www.bigfishgames.com/downloads/buzzwords/index.html), with launches in some other channels soon. It's hard to pin down exactly how long it took to make, work-wise, because all of the team worked part- or full-time jobs at some point in development. The generalized version of our timeline is basically:

February, IGDA Meeting:
I show some small experimental gameplay projects I've been working on. One of the chapter members points out we could possibly target the casual/indie market with our skillset and tools, suggests I check out Dexterity's articles and forum.

March, GDC:
Talk to friends I've worked with on previous projects about the idea of starting our own casual games company. Attend as many casual sessions as I can to better understand the market and relevant design issues. Also, pick up business card from a RealOne Arcade producer at the expo (they were pushing their developer contest).

Early April:
Two friends from college move out to Arizona to form our art department.

April-May:
Near full-time work on the project. Meet at E3 with the Real producer whose business card I got at GDC.

Summer:
Individual money reserves run out. Much of the team picks up jobs ranging from contract work to full-time game industry employement. Work on the game is slow, but still happening.

September:
I resume full-time development to finish up the game.

October-November:
Business development, distribution channel connections, customizations for particular channels, etc.

Now, a few weeks into launch:
Total 3rd-party sales are exceeding 100 units/day (sorry, can't give any channel-specific numbers), and I'm just setting up our 1st-party sales (www.playbuzzwords.com). Our 1st-party sales are something of an experiment; the plan all along was to focus on 3rd-party distribution channels. Everything is going really well, with some minor setbacks; we landed in 12th place in our first two weeks at RealOne Arcade, which may doom our chances of heavy promotion there.

Moving forward, we've started pre-production on two new projects. We plan to use our first few checks to set up an office space to better focus as a group (there's only three of us local; my brother lead up audio production from Minnesota). Most of the team is still working other jobs full-time. In the meantime, I'm working on pushing Buzzwords out to more distribution channels and maximizing its potential.

Did you just say 100 sales per day? Not 100 downloads? 100 sales?

I wish I could get 100 sales per day :)

I made around $6000 with my first game but it's on 2 years.

So Real Arcade is worth it ?

I may try them for my next project .

Originally posted by AnotherDev
So Real Arcade is worth it ?
I may try them for my next project .
It's more like if they decide to try you... I contacted them twice and all I got was "your game has been placed in your review queue", not to hear from them again... not even to say "we aren't interested" :(

Yeah, 100 sales (this is combined 3rd party sales, though--not just one channel). We're converting between 2-3%...

Nice Mathew. I've only checked out the screenshots of BBW, does it play like popcaps 'book worm'? I'll give it a whirl this afternoon.

Originally posted by Nick Bischoff
Nice Mathew. I've only checked out the screenshots of BBW, does it play like popcaps 'book worm'? I'll give it a whirl this afternoon.

Yes and no...yes, because it's linear spelling on a hex grid, and no, because our over-arching game structure is much different. The tile count doesn't replenish every word, as in Bookworm, but rather based on deliberate seasonal/yearly pacing. It makes for some interesting ups and downs--winter starts to be come very stressful, which is offset by the relief of spring. Challenge Game is something different, too; basically a series of static boards with increasing difficulty (design goal being that players need to eventually replay a board several times to discover huge word possibilities in order to pass). Game over is when no valid words remain on the board.

Hopefully that all came out articulately. It's 7am here, and for some reason I haven't gone to bed yet...

Just played Buzzwords - great game, really put together well! The combination of the piano music and the art direction has made this possible the most relaxing game I've ever played... until my letters start running out, of course.

Well done - and glad to see you're getting good sales too.

Edit: I meant to ask - who did your music? Or is it stock music? I really like it!

100 sales a day! That's great. But how did you do that? Please could you share some info ?

Thanks in advance!

Well Matthew basically already said he actively pursued 3rd party publishers with large distribution channels. On top of that he has a good 2-3% conversion rate. Add two and two together and you get excellent sales.

However as simple as it sounds, Matthew made the right contacts early on (meeting with the RealOne producer in person) and then followed up. His game is also extremely polished and fun to play. There are not too many Indie games that fit both those categories.

In my opinion Matthew's story tells us that if you're able to complete a game, make it fun to play, and finally make sure it's polished - then doors will start to open for you with 3rd party publishers and distribution channels and it will be possible to achieve sales like Matthew has.

Unfortunately, many Indie devs put too much importance in just finishing the game. While that is a huge milestone for a Indie developer to finish a game (believe me), that doesn't mean we deserve high sales or that publishers must distribute our games. Making the game fun to play and polished is what separates the Indie who sells 5 games a month and the Indie who sells over 500 a month.

Marketing is extremely important too, just as important as the game itself. However, if your game is fun and polished you can possibly leverage a 3rd party publisher in addition to your own 1st party marketing.

It really comes down to why you're developing a game. If the purpose is to make money, then you have to make sure other people enjoy it not just yourself. You have to make sure it's polished enough for a publisher to easily promote it commercially. Though if your purpose is to just create your pet project irregardless if other people find it playable and the game is bug ridden and looks raw, then don't expect for a 3rd party publisher to pick up your game and don't be surprised if you suffer from a low conversion rate.

I'm not saying a good Indie game markets itself entirely. But unlike the retail industry where you can market a bad or mediocre game under a movie license or some IP, a bad and even some mediocre Indie games are simply not marketable.

While I do agree that 100 sales/day is an AWESOME result, expecially for a FIRST game release, bear in mind that since he is mostly using 3rd party publishers, he get half earnings of those 100 sales.
Basically, he could get the same money selling 50/day alone, and he would also get customers emails (really useful).

Not saying that this is easy, of course :))) To do that alone you'd need to invest in advertising...

Well, one day I'll have too a game with good CR, and I'll start adversiting myself... so I'll see if it works or not :p

Jack: That's a very good point, and one I probably should've mentioned myself. Believe me, as a market newcomer our royalty on these sales is much less than half.

johnson: Chris basically answered your question as well as I could. I think one thing we did really well was focus on the casual market from the project's inception. We tried to keep the game as simple, accessible, and appealing as possible--every decision was viewed in the context of the casual market (think 35 year-old woman). Aside from that, we made sure to put as much polish on everything as possible; if a menu, piece of art, interaction, or whatever was lacking it was retouched or redone.

Midnight: Music was composed for the project. My brother makes up the audio side of the company. He did much of the composition and worked with some other friends on production quality. We lucked out in that regard, since we had no money; everything was done very informally and without a contract. We've since set up an agreeable royalty rate for their efforts, but it was almost an afterthought (they've done a lot of audio work for other hobby projects in our past just for the sake of creation).

Believe me, as a market newcomer our royalty on these sales is much less than half.
argh!! less than half! :eek:
since half is about 10$, less than that would be around 6-7$ per copy... still at 100/day is 600$/day which is awesome (three time what I did with my first game the first month!!).

However in future games I think you should first test it selling it on your own, and if you get good CR, maybe try to market it yourself (if you have time and you're willing to try).

I recently made a poll about going with a publisher or not.
While I've changed my negative view towards publishers, I still won't sign for less than 40% of the royalties... expecially with a game who has good CR like yours :)

I think, if they had tried selling it from their own website at first, they'd be making significantly less money overall, at this point. They did a good job of tailoring the game to the market that the publishers serve, and that's why they're getting lots of sales. If they were selling it themselves, I doubt they would even be making half the money they currently are because they would suffer from the same problem every other new team has - no one knows who they are, or that they should be looking for their game.

Doing it yourself is not always the answer, especially if you're really good at building games that publishers can sell.