LordKronos
06-21-2003, 01:45 PM
Posted by BrewKnowC at 06-14-2003 09:22 PM
Hi, I'm pushing hard to release my game by the summer (working full time and game dev'ing on the side) and I went to write the instructions page screens into my game and realized that my game has gotten somewhat complex and would need more than just a couple pages and images. My real question is: Is it too 'cheesy' to make the instructions link in the game open up an HTML doc with all the instructions? or is it better to have the instructions all 'in-game'? all opinions welcome.
~BC
Posted by Luggage at 06-14-2003 09:33 PM
Hello
I don't think it would be too cheesy although personally I'd rather see the instructions within the game. So if it showed a pickup it can animate and look like the pickup from in game and so on.
Do you mean to have an instruction option inside the game and that will kick in their browser and minimise their app? Or just a link on their shortcut menu to the docs. The later is definately preferred by me out of the two.
Posted by MirekCz at 06-15-2003 03:28 AM
well prepared html doc has got one big advantage - you can print it easily.
In-game help is fine, but it's often either done "bad" (like hard to read, funky fonts) or not going in-depth explaining the game.
For me the best job does a html manual + small in-game help explaining the very basics (prefered training levels with text messages what to do to finish them)
__________________
With best regards,
Mirek Czerwiński
www.bitween.com
Photo Editor for P800 - Manage your photos with a touch of class
Posted by Richardc at 06-15-2003 05:04 AM
Why dont you use the embeded webrowser component and make it part of your UI. every lang I can think of has one.
__________________
Delphi is not a dead language...
Posted by LordKronos at 06-15-2003 07:31 AM
I use HTML help linked from within the game, but I'll be putting the help into the game eventually. I only used a separate file as a time-saving measure.
The only problem with HTML help that I have is that it takes you out of the game, and it seems no matter how hard you try to do things right, there always ends up being some crummy drivers somewhere that crash when your app loses or gains focus again (this is basically the Alt-Tab problem that is well know). I think I've got that problem solved, but this is the third time I thought I had it solved. For that reason alone, I would like to have the help in the game (if the Alt-Tab issue isn't solved, at least this would minimize the chance of someone stumbling onto it).
__________________
Ron Frazier
Kronos software
http://www.kronos-software.com
Posted by Fariz at 06-15-2003 07:46 AM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by BrewKnowC
Hi, I'm pushing hard to release my game by the summer (working full time and game dev'ing on the side) and I went to write the instructions page screens into my game and realized that my game has gotten somewhat complex and would need more than just a couple pages and images. My real question is: Is it too 'cheesy' to make the instructions link in the game open up an HTML doc with all the instructions? or is it better to have the instructions all 'in-game'? all opinions welcome.
~BC
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Better make it both. Remember that if you make help docs with images assigned to your demo distribution file, it makes file size bigger and can impact # of downloads. So, you can consider making ingame/attached help file text only (or with graphix which is already in the game, but it will require distributing game with your game graphix in some open format). Add to in-game help/attached html help link to your website, and make the full manual (with all immages, info etc.) there. Make a separate distribution file with full manual, and let people download it to replace a short version. If you provide separate download for a full version add the complete manual there.
Just my $0.02
Posted by Karukef at 06-15-2003 04:52 PM
When it comes to game, the help is a rather important design issue. It should always be a goal to make the help in-game, and so intuitive (coupled of course with an equally intuitive interface for your game) that external help like html or a manual serve only as "additional reading".
This is even more true for downloadable games, as the player are likely to give it less time and effort than a game they actually buy in a store. That is, if they bought a boxed game for lots of money, they really will read the manual if there is something they want to know. With shareware, it is easy to just quit and not bother playing more. They can download a new one in a few minutes.
In-game help for shareware is a must in my opinion.
Posted by Hydroaxe at 06-15-2003 05:22 PM
If you're finding that your game is complex then the best thing to have is an in-game tutorial... and by that I mean built right into the game... not separate. I had suggested this myself for the last project I was involved in, (which was not complex) and instead we went through all the other less effective stages of having an instructions page outside the game, having an instructions screen inside the game, to having an instructions screen and a separate tutorial in the game.
The game still does not have a built in tutorial and even one reviewer who wrote about the game never bothered to try the separate tutorial until he was really stuck. Does this put it into perspective? It was of no genius on my part. To me it's just common sense. Players just want to play. They will even send angry emails to you without ever having read a single word of instructions. I don't hold this against them though. I'm on their side.
__________________
www.hydroaxe.com/
Posted by BrewKnowC at 06-15-2003 09:34 PM
ok so i guess this answers my question (and i guess making an HTML help page was a little lazy on my part), but considering that most people don't even read the instructions UNTIL they get stuck, basic instructins plus an in-game tutorial seems like the best solution (thanks Hydro for the tip).
Hi, I'm pushing hard to release my game by the summer (working full time and game dev'ing on the side) and I went to write the instructions page screens into my game and realized that my game has gotten somewhat complex and would need more than just a couple pages and images. My real question is: Is it too 'cheesy' to make the instructions link in the game open up an HTML doc with all the instructions? or is it better to have the instructions all 'in-game'? all opinions welcome.
~BC
Posted by Luggage at 06-14-2003 09:33 PM
Hello
I don't think it would be too cheesy although personally I'd rather see the instructions within the game. So if it showed a pickup it can animate and look like the pickup from in game and so on.
Do you mean to have an instruction option inside the game and that will kick in their browser and minimise their app? Or just a link on their shortcut menu to the docs. The later is definately preferred by me out of the two.
Posted by MirekCz at 06-15-2003 03:28 AM
well prepared html doc has got one big advantage - you can print it easily.
In-game help is fine, but it's often either done "bad" (like hard to read, funky fonts) or not going in-depth explaining the game.
For me the best job does a html manual + small in-game help explaining the very basics (prefered training levels with text messages what to do to finish them)
__________________
With best regards,
Mirek Czerwiński
www.bitween.com
Photo Editor for P800 - Manage your photos with a touch of class
Posted by Richardc at 06-15-2003 05:04 AM
Why dont you use the embeded webrowser component and make it part of your UI. every lang I can think of has one.
__________________
Delphi is not a dead language...
Posted by LordKronos at 06-15-2003 07:31 AM
I use HTML help linked from within the game, but I'll be putting the help into the game eventually. I only used a separate file as a time-saving measure.
The only problem with HTML help that I have is that it takes you out of the game, and it seems no matter how hard you try to do things right, there always ends up being some crummy drivers somewhere that crash when your app loses or gains focus again (this is basically the Alt-Tab problem that is well know). I think I've got that problem solved, but this is the third time I thought I had it solved. For that reason alone, I would like to have the help in the game (if the Alt-Tab issue isn't solved, at least this would minimize the chance of someone stumbling onto it).
__________________
Ron Frazier
Kronos software
http://www.kronos-software.com
Posted by Fariz at 06-15-2003 07:46 AM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by BrewKnowC
Hi, I'm pushing hard to release my game by the summer (working full time and game dev'ing on the side) and I went to write the instructions page screens into my game and realized that my game has gotten somewhat complex and would need more than just a couple pages and images. My real question is: Is it too 'cheesy' to make the instructions link in the game open up an HTML doc with all the instructions? or is it better to have the instructions all 'in-game'? all opinions welcome.
~BC
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Better make it both. Remember that if you make help docs with images assigned to your demo distribution file, it makes file size bigger and can impact # of downloads. So, you can consider making ingame/attached help file text only (or with graphix which is already in the game, but it will require distributing game with your game graphix in some open format). Add to in-game help/attached html help link to your website, and make the full manual (with all immages, info etc.) there. Make a separate distribution file with full manual, and let people download it to replace a short version. If you provide separate download for a full version add the complete manual there.
Just my $0.02
Posted by Karukef at 06-15-2003 04:52 PM
When it comes to game, the help is a rather important design issue. It should always be a goal to make the help in-game, and so intuitive (coupled of course with an equally intuitive interface for your game) that external help like html or a manual serve only as "additional reading".
This is even more true for downloadable games, as the player are likely to give it less time and effort than a game they actually buy in a store. That is, if they bought a boxed game for lots of money, they really will read the manual if there is something they want to know. With shareware, it is easy to just quit and not bother playing more. They can download a new one in a few minutes.
In-game help for shareware is a must in my opinion.
Posted by Hydroaxe at 06-15-2003 05:22 PM
If you're finding that your game is complex then the best thing to have is an in-game tutorial... and by that I mean built right into the game... not separate. I had suggested this myself for the last project I was involved in, (which was not complex) and instead we went through all the other less effective stages of having an instructions page outside the game, having an instructions screen inside the game, to having an instructions screen and a separate tutorial in the game.
The game still does not have a built in tutorial and even one reviewer who wrote about the game never bothered to try the separate tutorial until he was really stuck. Does this put it into perspective? It was of no genius on my part. To me it's just common sense. Players just want to play. They will even send angry emails to you without ever having read a single word of instructions. I don't hold this against them though. I'm on their side.
__________________
www.hydroaxe.com/
Posted by BrewKnowC at 06-15-2003 09:34 PM
ok so i guess this answers my question (and i guess making an HTML help page was a little lazy on my part), but considering that most people don't even read the instructions UNTIL they get stuck, basic instructins plus an in-game tutorial seems like the best solution (thanks Hydro for the tip).